SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

Thank you Dr. I appreciate the help.

@MNBS

Has she even begun to discuss her 'whys' yet?

If so what were they? She blew up your family, you'd like to think she'd at least offer an explanation.

I pulled some why questions from a book at gave to her to help create something for her letter to me in the first round of 'make it or break it' couples counceling.

The whys were mostly focused on childhood upbringing (not being comfortable sharing emotions), not feeling 'good enough', many casual sexual experiences in college, none that turned into a relationship besides me. Pressure of succeeding in her business, having 'vertigo' for a little while 2 years ago, seeking attention/validation from someone who 'noticed' her/that she lost weight, etc. I'll have to look back at the letter.

I strongly suggest you do not change her financial situation by selling the business. If you ultimately end up divorcing and she technically has no more income you could end up in a very bad financial situation for a long time. A judge may order you to pay alimony, you will definitely be paying child support if the kids are under 18.

It took my wife a while just to use the word affair. She would refer to it as the incident. While talking with my IC one day I mentioned this and she stopped me. She said until your wife can take full accountability for the affair and use the word AFFAIR, reconciliation will be very hard.

So the next time my wife and I were talking and she used the word incident I said something to the effect of how are we going to try and fix this relationship if you can't even say the word affair?

Imo, she didn't want to use that word because that would make her an adulterous. Now it was obvious she was but she struggled to accept it. Hell I think it was a few months before she finally accepted full responsibility and could honestly answer the question "what did you think would happen if I found out?"

Her response had been I never thought about it but after a few months she finally admitted "I figured you would be upset for a few days and then get over it." Obviously at this point she had little to zero respect for my feelings and the potential Fallout. She was having way too much fun

In the beginning I was the one reading and researching everything I could and my wife was content to just let me until I finally told her you need to be the one doing this. You need to be the one trying to figure out how to fix this. And I learned this after finding this forum

My advice is that you do the 180 and just walk away. Make some appointments with divorce attorneys just to see where you stand and let your wife know you're doing it. Tell her you are not actively filing for divorce but you want to know where you stand should she not put in the effort to repair the damage she caused

The WS has to grasp the reality that their actions may very well have destroyed the relationship and divorce is the outcome ESPECIALLY if he/she doesn't put in a buttload of effort

All of us understand that your brain is going a mile a minute and that is totally understandable and to be expected. It's hard to implement some of the advice given here. For me I was scared to death that she had no problem just saying okay, we're done, let's get the divorce over with so I can move on. It took me a long time to get my proverbial balls back but once I did that's when Real Change started to happen

Keep posting if you feel it's helping. For me the more I talked about it the better I felt, but that's me

Thank you for the guidance WB1340 and everyone else who has taken time out of their day to help me.

The 180 has only been going for 24 hrs. We're in separate levels of the house. I slept from 3am to 5am last night and had to take a personal day so I wasn't a zombie at work and to focus on ME today. Long walk, some excercises, few things around the house. I finally got sleep med from my Dr. and hope to even take a nap. I've only been averaging 5 hours per night when I have averaged 7.5 over the last 3-4 years so I finally reached out for help.

I had told her parents a week after Dday because I though they would be able to support her. All it did was make her furious! Little did I know she blames half of her issues on her parents (they are great people by the way) even if they aren't the huggy/feely type and were completely blown away that she has done this. They want to be supportive but don't know how. They are REALLY concerned about her depression and mental well being (talked about wanting to bring her to a treatment facility). They are really sad that she hasn't had the guts to talk to them in the month since then. I think they might have finally lost their patience and might confront her today. I'm pretty nervous to find out how it goes. I believe going back to the gym and to work with the fake smile all day is keeping her from hitting 'rock bottom' much like a drug addict. Yeah, she has to WANT to get better/accept help and support. I have finally started to realize I can only control me.

Deleted because i realized my message was about my fear and not your problem. Sorry, didn't think it would be helpful.

[This message edited by Onceasailor at 6:52 PM, Monday, September 28th]

I've come close to calling 911 several times because of her self worth comments

This is critically important: if she EVER threatens self-harm, stop what you are doing and CALL 911. Either she’s truly suicidal and she therefore absolutely requires emergency services OR she’s bluffing/deflecting (more likely). Guess what calling 911 will do? SHE WILL STOP THAT QUICK. I hope you can see, whatever the case may be, calling 911 is the way forward the next time she directly threatens self harm.

I'm pretty nervous to find out how it goes.

May I ask why you fear her so?

You are not in reconciliation while she is still at the gym. 15 years in. CrossFit trust me. It’s all that’s talked about in class and in the class there will be most/many who knew about and supported the affair.

This isn’t a grey area thing. I’ve been to and belonged to a number of them. I’ll punch myself in the face if I’m wrong, that’s how certain I am.

Sharkman- can you explain more? What is talked about all class? Sex? What do you suggest? A different gym? Do I need to start gong to that gym? Thanks

I can't speak for Sharkman, but I'm pretty sure he just means that your wife's affair is likely a pretty big, juicy piece of gossip, and when you have a group of people who hang out together on a regular basis they're going to be talking about it. Some may have even egged her on or encouraged her to get into it. If that's the case, those people are not friends of your marriage. They may be gossiping and chit-chatting about it with her for a significant portion of the time she's there.

Now, I'm not a gym rat so that's all just speculation territory coming from me. I don't know what all goes on in those settings, but I think that could be plausible. It's possible she's hanging out with some co-conspirators there and cooking up new schemes or stories for you. Maybe at a minimum answering questions and discussing details about her affair with them. I know I wouldn't be okay with my wife hanging out at the place where she hooked up with her AP.

I let her go back so I didn't have to hear her whine about it. She claimed NO OTHER GYM is good enough/has a 'community' like the one she's been going to for 9 years.

What's really so special about that particular gym that she can't get somewhere else? What 'community'? The hypothetical one I described above? Does she want to save her marriage or not? I'd like to see someone who wouldn't whine about it so much as jump at the chance to do something that might make you feel at least a little bit like she's willing to do whatever it takes to make you feel safer.

At the same time, gym settings in general seem like pretty ripe breeding grounds for affairs. This is not the first time we've heard about an affair that started at a gym. There just seems to be something about working out with people in tight, revealing clothes, breaking a sweat, and working toward mutual goals that seems to generate those types of feelings in some people.

If Sharkman meant that the gym class is a circlejerk where they validate each other's worst choices, I do agree that it is highly probable. Going there might be hilarious if you have fun with making people uncomfortable.

My two cents.

There are other gyms. She can certainly go and find new friends at a gym. Just like she did at the one she’s at. The fact that she chooses not to reflects (to me) that her betrayed spouse and marriage are not a priority.

Her parents finally confronted her and talked to her for a couple hours monday morning. She's not yet talked about anything to me about that. But her dad texted me and did a real nice job of blame shifting shit on me so I wasn't real happy or receptive to that.

She is now too 'depressed' to be close or intimate with me but obviously not too depressed to go to the gym. I am going with her tue to her primary doctor visit where she claims she is finally for the first time ever going to be open/honest about the depth of her depressive state. I'm hoping for a breakthrough of sorts (meds?). I'm desperate for any kind of help.

I looked at her phone the other day. It's probably the 5th time I've quickly looked at it and now it's happened a 2nd time. All text messages deleted between her and the gym owner/friend except 2 from that day. I lost my shit a little bit. "what are you trying to hide" Sure, that's great she has someone she can talk to (why is it never a women friend/gym friend?) Even if they are just discussing our current issues and how hard this road is. Because he IS supportive, he is not a threat to me at this time. By not deleting shit I could read that and feel safe about it and it would build trusts. Now, it's just another thing she's hiding from me to 'protect me' but we all know it's just to protect her.

Question in regards to the 180. I have always been the home cook. I have a 14 and 16 year old. I make family style meals every other day or so- so busy kids can eat when they come and go from sports/work and there's always 2-3 different leftover options to heat up. She's still getting 100% of her meals cooked for her except her morning protein shake. Any suggestions with this situation? Thanks

[This message edited by MNBS at 1:54 PM, Friday, October 2nd]

I hope you told your FIL where to stick it. But the real take away is that she failed to take any accountability with her parents. FIL got his ideas from her.

Deleting messages is super shady and frankly stupid given the open device policy you have.

However, my understanding of the 180 is that you should not be checking her phone. You should be acting like she’s a roommate that you’d like to avoid as much as possible.

All that said, you’re also trying to be pleasant. So if you’re making family style meals, I’m not sure you would or could tell her she can’t eat them. The only way to avoid that is to change how you prepare dinner, I guess.

You're correct on the phone/180. It was right before the 180, part of what got me to go there.

Yeah I don't know about any 'accountability' or if she just blamed them for what she did. I'm sure she didn't share half of her childhood/college issues at all. Apparently she did tell them "I really fucked up". No shit......

[This message edited by MNBS at 4:25 PM, Friday, October 2nd]

MNBS:

My friend, her affair is likely still active. But I think you know this based on the deleted text messages.

You know she is not remorseful based on the response from your FIL.

No remorse; ongoing affair.

What is there to save? If she wanted you...ACTUALLY wanted you...would she be moving the way she is moving?

No all prisons have bars, my friend. Yet there you sit, lamenting your confinement when the only thing keeping you imprisoned is YOU. Until you realize it, nothing changes.

Love yourself enough to refuse to tolerate the intolerable.

Thank you. I'm not saying you are wrong.

But I don't know that it's still active. The deleted text history was not with her AP just two people she was talking to about our situation. People that were never a threat to me but does not look good just based on deleting shit. I don't know of any attempted contact by the AP.

[This message edited by MNBS at 5:09 PM, Friday, October 2nd]

Brother,

I think you already have figured this out but:

The reason that she's deleting texts with these people is that they contain facts that she has not disclosed to you. These people may or may not be trying to help her hide things from you but she's at minimum trying to manage them and their knowledge of her activities. I think your problem may be larger than you have thus far been made aware.

The only person who has willingly shared information with you is the AP's wife. Everyone else, your wife and the gym "community" are all actively keeping things from you. They are her community, not yours.

Have you considered just getting the hell out of there for a while? Disconnect yourself from the situation, get space and peace. Go to your parents house for a week or so. Hit your own gym (not that one.) Perhaps take a vacation, camp, hike, get some fresh air and don't communicate with her. Begin the process of detaching. Take care of you.

I wish I could. I teach full time. I have taken 2 days off since the year started because of lack of sleep. It's 10x more work writing sub plans for 3 different grade levels/3 different lab classes than just going to work.

Just to state the obvious, this "friend" could be acting as a go-between with AP.